END TIMES Open Discussion, ALL comments welcome,

[JLB]

This is the reason I read,
To find out the HOSTORY of protestantism.
Why even joing a ORGANIZATION w/o knowing at the very least some miniscule portion of its history
Bet if I go to Joel Osteen's aassembly, their personal homes library, bet any money i find zero books on american protestantism,, MUCH LESS any book of Jung.
There ya go = Ignorance is Bliss.
vs
Yeshua's very words ((NOT in english, but in old oldddd spiritual greek, which beats out old hebrew)
I'll take Yeshua's word over any religious organization beliefs any day
How about you guys??
Same I hope.
Lets focus on what Yeshua is trying to say, vs a religious org's interpretations.
This way we can never ever go on the wrong path.

Can you address the scriptures I gave?

Let's start with recognizing the three main things that happen at the coming of the LORD.

Hopefully we can start by finding common ground and build on that.


Three main things that occur at the coming of the lord.

Context: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:11

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• The first thing we see is the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16

• The second thing that occurs at his coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17

Notice here the resurrection and rapture are one event that occurs at His coming!



The third thing we see that occurs at His coming is the destruction of the wicked including the antichrist.

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

Notice here the coming of the LORD does not come as a thief in the night for the watching Church; watching the signs He gave us to watch for.

Context: 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8



The three mains things that occur at the coming of the LORD:

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings JLB,

• The second thing that occurs at his coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17
Notice here the resurrection and rapture are one event that occurs at His coming!

I disagree here. I consider being caught up in the air is figurative language and not the rapture. The faithful will become the new rulers in the new Heaven and Earth. It does not say that they will taken to literal heaven, God's Throne.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[JLB]

Greetings JLB,

I disagree here. I consider being caught up in the air is figurative language and not the rapture. The faithful will become the new rulers in the new Heaven and Earth. It does not say that they will taken to literal heaven, God's Throne.

Kind regards
Trevor

It's clear both the dead in Christ, as well as those who are alive and remain will be caught up together in the clouds, in the air, to be gathered to the Lord.

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17

Then the Lord will pour out destruction upon the wicked, and cleanse the earth, as He continues to head toward Jerusalem, to the mount of Olives, then He will take His place on His throne in Jerusalem to reign as King over the earth.


Behold, the day of the LORD is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
Then the LORD will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,
From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
n the days of Uzziah king of Judah.
Thus the LORD my God will come,
And all the saints with You. Zechariah 14:1-5

• Thus the LORD my God will come, and all the saints with You.

And the LORD shall be King over all the earth. In that day it shall be— “The LORD is one,” and His name one. Zechariah 14:9

And this shall be the plague with which the LORD will strike all the people who fought against Jerusalem:
Their flesh shall dissolve while they stand on their feet, their eyes shall dissolve in their sockets, and their tongues shall dissolve in their mouths. Zechariah 14:12




JLB

 

[YeshuaGlory]

Can you address the scriptures I gave?

Let's start with recognizing the three main things that happen at the coming of the LORD.

Hopefully we can start by finding common ground and build on that.


Three main things that occur at the coming of the lord.

Context: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:11

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• The first thing we see is the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16

• The second thing that occurs at his coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17

Notice here the resurrection and rapture are one event that occurs at His coming!



The third thing we see that occurs at His coming is the destruction of the wicked including the antichrist.

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

Notice here the coming of the LORD does not come as a thief in the night for the watching Church; watching the signs He gave us to watch for.

Context: 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8



The three mains things that occur at the coming of the LORD:

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

wish I could, But can not, address the scriptures you refer.
For many reasons i will avoid exgeting these very mysterioys/controversial/vague/imagistic verses.
Just not in my interest.
My OP is more about situations/evenst/movements in the world today.
I mean if God opened the meanings on these verses, I might share. But He has not.
My belif is when there is a out pouring in 2028, there will be fellwoships that will say **we have the spirit also,, its over here,,,woooohooooo** Jumping around acting crazy, miminicing the real out pouring ona small group in their community.
I can see it already happening. I just left a assembly tonight, was my 1st fellowship, Only the pastor and his wife reamins,, all others hit the highway.
The place is crazy.

This is what will take place in the near future and is ongoing now.
But when the move really begins, the groups which God avoids like the plague ,, will get not just jealous,, but dark green envious and cast asperions and rumors about the small group which God did visit with His Holy Gifts.
This will occur, not ona few ocassions, but in epedemic.
People will be running to and fro,,, saying,, its over here,,, no wait,, over there,,, here,,,there....All the while these roge christians will try to disrupt the good things God is doing in the small PRIVATE assembly.
It will happen.
I can envision this.
Most will be deceived.
The few will know that God loves them and will not allow foreigners to invade their Assembly of Agape.
This happened in the early church and these events will take place this next out pouring. 2028ish.
Yeshua already gave us stern warnings about these things.
This is the kind of verses I want to bring into the light,, and not anything to do w The Rapture, and all your other verses you brought up.

 

[YeshuaGlory]

Greetings JLB,

I disagree here. I consider being caught up in the air is figurative language and not the rapture. The faithful will become the new rulers in the new Heaven and Earth. It does not say that they will taken to literal heaven, God's Throne.

Kind regards
Trevor

No, raptures take place in God's Kingdom, past present future. Its not figurative. although God can grant Holy power to find escpes from very difficult situations ofa critical nature = a rapture.
THe faithful will rule??
Who the faithful gentiles??
The bible does not teach the **faithful gentile remnant will rule**
The faithful Remnant jews will rule out of Jerusalem. The few gentiles at that time will submit to Yeshua's Rulership.
The gentiles, the few that survive,, will seek God';s Laws there in Jerusalem at that distant time. = Do not hold your breath.
Revelation is NOT a Hollywood movie script.
So do not read Rev as you would a novel, a story. .

 

[JLB]

wish I could, But can not, address the scriptures you refer.

I see.


Ok have a nice day.

 

[JLB]

No, raptures take place in God's Kingdom, past present future. Its not figurative. although God can grant Holy power to find escpes from very difficult situations ofa critical nature = a rapture.
THe faithful will rule??
Who the faithful gentiles??
The bible does not teach the **faithful gentile remnant will rule**
The faithful Remnant jews will rule out of Jerusalem. The few gentiles at that time will submit to Yeshua's Rulership.
The gentiles, the few that survive,, will seek God';s Laws there in Jerusalem at that distant time. = Do not hold your breath.
Revelation is NOT a Hollywood movie script.
So do not read Rev as you would a novel, a story. .

What word would you prefer to use instead of Rapture?

The catching up of the living in Christ?

• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them

Three main things that occur at the coming of the Lord.

Context: 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:11

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15

• The first thing we see is the resurrection of the dead in Christ.

For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 1 Thessalonians 4:16

• The second thing that occurs at His coming, after the resurrection of the dead in Christ, is the rapture of the church.

Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.1 Thessalonians 4:17

Notice here the resurrection and rapture are one event that occurs at His coming!



The third thing we see that occurs at His coming is the destruction of the wicked including the antichrist.

But concerning the times and the seasons, brethren, you have no need that I should write to you. For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thessalonians 5:1-4

Notice here the coming of the LORD does not come as a thief in the night for the watching Church; watching the signs He gave us to watch for.

Context: 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12

And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 2 Thessalonians 2:8



The three mains things that occur at the coming of the LORD:

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again JLB and YeshuaGlory,

The three mains things that occur at the coming of the LORD:

1. The resurrection of the dead in Christ.
2. The rapture of the church.
3. The destruction of the wicked: including the antichrist

I can agree in general, but would be more specific.
1. The resurrection of the faithful in Christ and some of the wicked. The Judgement and rejection of these wicked.
2. I prefer to not use the word "rapture" as it is sometimes used to speak of going to heaven. The gathering and judgement of those that are "responsible", and the faithful being united with the faithful dead, and both groups becoming the rulers of the Age to Come.
3. There will be some Judgements on the Wicked, but the process of Armageddon and afterwards is to purify Israel and the nations, and destroy those that become hardened against Christ and His Rule, and this will involve the destruction of the AntiChrist and his adherents after Armageddon.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[JLB]

Greetings again JLB and YeshuaGlory,

I can agree in general, but would be more specific.
1. The resurrection of the faithful in Christ and some of the wicked. The Judgement and rejection of these wicked.
2. I prefer to not use the word "rapture" as it is sometimes used to speak of going to heaven. The gathering and judgement of those that are "responsible", and the faithful being united with the faithful dead, and both groups becoming the rulers of the Age to Come.
3. There will be some Judgements on the Wicked, but the process of Armageddon and afterwards is to purify Israel and the nations, and destroy those that become hardened against Christ and His Rule, and this will involve the destruction of the AntiChrist and his adherents after Armageddon.

Kind regards
Trevor

Thanks for your input.

Let's see if we can at least agree on the first two things.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 1 Thessalonians 4:15


Do you agree that the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture, occur at His coming?

 

[YeshuaGlory]

Keep in mind
End Time= The Geniles last and final epoch of rulership over planet earth
I would not worry about raptures, how the dead rise at the very very end, etc, How Yeshua comes back ona Cloud of Glory, who will actually see Yeshua. at that moment,, if it is just only a moment,, = Yeshua flying around the earth on a cloud,, **Hi everyone its me, Yeshua,, I came back to earth., exactly like I left and told you I would come back**
There are many more critically important verses which we all need to be aware and understand about OUR (in time, in the yr 2024 and OUR generation NOW/future/til our mini epoch passes away and followers of Yeshua past us the living now, have to understand their lifetime mini epoch)
What verses are in reference to the very end of this collective epoch, is not my concern.

I recall Yeshua telling 2 disciples after His Resurrection when both asked Him about **a certain disciple's future on earth*** Yeshua said
**What happens to this (John) disciple is only My concern, not yours, stay focused on what you need to accomplish for my kingdom, Do not worry about what happens to John**
I tell you the same, Do not worry about the very last events, Its none of our business right now.
Let us focused on whats going on in our gen, our epoch NOW

 

[hawkman]

MOD NOTE , THREAD HAS BEEN CLEANED UP PLEASE REMEBER THIS TOS .

1.4: Do not misquote or misrepresent another member. Do not state a negative opinion about a member's denomination, leaders, founders, or the veracity of a member's faith. (Exodus 20:16)

 

[Ezekiel]

Anyone can post anything they wish about anything/any subject dealing w the Epoch we live in today.
No ones comment will be considered OFF TOPIC. A=Z, Alpha - Omega,, THis way we can all share whatever we see/hear/know about this epoch we live in today.
We are Children of Light, Let us enlighten each other on this topic.

If any has read the book of Enoch or any of the books of the first 7 I will speak if not let it go.

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again JLB and YeshuaGlory,

Do you agree that the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the rapture, occur at His coming?

I consider that the faithful and some of the unfaithful or wicked will be resurrected first when Jesus returns.
Daniel 12:1–3 (KJV): 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
Jesus will thus raise some of the wicked or unfaithful and both the faithful and the unfaithful will be judged.

I am reticent to use the word "rapture" as I consider the following is an extended figure of the process of making the ruling class, the clouds, of the Age to Come:
1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 (KJV): 13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

I tell you the same, Do not worry about the very last events, Its none of our business right now.
Let us focused on whats going on in our gen, our epoch NOW

I consider that we are in the very midst or the start of the Time of the End, and these events are very much our present concern as they will affect each and every one of us. We need to be alert to ALL that Jesus and the prophets have given us, and this should bring a proper preparation and readiness to meet the Lord when he comes. The Roman and Jewish elite in Jerusalem were caught off guard when Jesus was born in Bethlehem, but the shepherds of Bethlehem and the Wise Men from the East responded and were blessed. Simeon and Anna were also prepared in their hearts in Jerusalem. There is a strong transforming power in the Word of God when we understand it correctly.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[JLB]

I consider that the faithful and some of the unfaithful or wicked will be resurrected first when Jesus returns.
Daniel 12:1–3 (KJV): 1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book. 2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. 3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.
Jesus will thus raise some of the wicked or unfaithful and both the faithful and the unfaithful will be judged.

Do you agree that the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the catching up of those who are alive and remain, occurs at His coming?

Yes?
No?
Don't know?

Notice in this verse is specifically mentions the dead in Christ. Not the wicked dead.


For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17

Here is who are mentioned:

• that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
• the dead in Christ will rise first.
• Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.

JLB

 

[TrevorL]

Greetings again JLB,

Do you agree that the resurrection of the dead in Christ and the catching up of those who are alive and remain, occurs at His coming?
Yes?
No?
Don't know?

Yes, the faithful dead and alive will end up as the clouds in the air (figurative language) of the New Heaven and New Earth.

Notice in this verse is specifically mentions the dead in Christ. Not the wicked dead.

The additional detail is supplied in Daniel 12:1-3, that some of the wicked dead will be raised and judged at the same time as the faithful dead. Paul is only concerned about comforting the Thessalonians about the few faithful who had recently died, possibly by persecution.

Kind regards
Trevor

 

[JLB]

Yes, the faithful dead and alive will end up as the clouds in the air

Ok, I'm glad we could at least agree on this point.


Thanks.

 

[JLB]

The additional detail is supplied in Daniel 12:1-3, that some of the wicked dead will be raised and judged at the same time as the faithful dead. Paul is only concerned about comforting the Thessalonians about the few faithful who had recently died, possibly by persecution.

In order to establish a common understanding among us, we should stick to what the passage itself is saying, and thereby establish common ground in which to build on, otherwise we have everyone pulling from scriptures everywhere trying to interject them into what Jesus was teaching us through Paul.


“At that time Michael shall stand up,
The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people;
And there shall be a time of trouble,
Such as never was since there was a nation,
Even to that time.
And at that time your people shall be delivered,
Every one who is found written in the book.
And many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake,
Some to everlasting life, some to shame and everlasting contempt. Daniel 12:1-2


Matthew 25:31-46 is a more in depth narrative of this.

It's interesting to note that all who were before His throne are His people, not the world mixed with His people.

A study of the context of Matthew 24:45-25:30 will prove beneficial to know and understand this truth.

• And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.

“When the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the holy angels with Him, then He will sit on the throne of His glory. All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats. And He will set the sheep on His right hand, but the goats on the left. Then the King will say to those on His right hand, ‘Come, you blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world: for I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me.’ “Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry and feed You, or thirsty and give You drink? When did we see You a stranger and take You in, or naked and clothe You? Or when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ And the King will answer and say to them, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.’
“Then He will also say to those on the left hand, Depart from Me, you cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels: for I was hungry and you gave Me no food; I was thirsty and you gave Me no drink; I was a stranger and you did not take Me in, naked and you did not clothe Me, sick and in prison and you did not visit Me.’
“Then they also will answer Him, saying, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry or thirsty or a stranger or naked or sick or in prison, and did not minister to You?’ Then He will answer them, saying, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ And these will go away into everlasting punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” Matthew 25:31-46

 

[KV-44-v1]

Yes even as of last yr, when news broke about AI on all major news channels, where a congressional hearing was discussing **THe dangers, the threats, the possible futures** of AI,, I had no understanding of what they were so afraid of
I asked a loacl tech geek (genius in all things electronics)),, about AI,, he went like **yeah well, the end of humanity as we know it..** But was not willing to give more insights.
Then I noted Tulane University Book Fair, big event,, has 2 days of speakers/authors on all things , most promote antichrist agenda, yet ina covert, subtle vain of language.
There was one speaker promoting AI.
So I researched it on his YT channels and other YT videos.
NOW I realize what AI is somewhat all about.
= Men will become EVEN MORE robotic than they are now with this AI Agenda in all universities curriculum.
The AI Robotic thinking vs
creative INSPIRATIONAL thinking/reflectional/intuitional process
AS we know from Revelation, AI will win out.
Most people have no understanding what AI is all about and really do not care.
AI is a major player in antichrist kingdom, = The Illuminati Agenda.
Things are out of the control now of Illuminati,, they are just going w the flow, but making sure whenever they can see opportunity to manipulate they will use their powers to do so.

All this seems to make sense of the dumbing down of the school systems. And acceptance of Evolution, bigbang, deeptime.

 

[KV-44-v1]

JLB

Brother in Jesus,

Would you like to aid in fighting naturalistic, counterBiblical evolution stories in the "Christianity and science" thread?
Right now there's a big debate going on - more fighters welcome.


One KV-44 tank

Versus 2 Evolutionists (I'm guessing Thiestic Evolutionists, but IDK about Uncle J)