What is the Great Tribulation?

[LeviR]

The antichrist is one of his horns... the little horn.

“After this I saw in the night visions, and behold, a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong. It had huge iron teeth; it was devouring, breaking in pieces, and trampling the residue with its feet. It was different from all the beasts that were before it, and it had ten horns. I was considering the horns, and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a man, and a mouth speaking pompous words. Daniel 7:7-8


The ten horns are ten kings who shall arise from this kingdom.
And another shall rise after them; he shall be different from the first ones,
And shall subdue three kings. He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, and shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand for a time and times and half a time. Daniel 7:24-25


Later on he will be called the king of the North, and can be identified by his "pompous" or "blasphemous words"


“Then the king shall do according to his own will: he shall exalt and magnify himself above every god, shall speak blasphemies against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the wrath has been accomplished; for what has been determined shall be done. He shall regard neither the God of his fathers nor the desire of women, nor regard any god; for he shall exalt himself above them all. Daniel 11:36-37

• I believe Paul had Daniel 11:36 in mind when he wrote his second letter to the Thessalonians -

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God. 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4

• the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

• he shall exalt himself above them all. Daniel
• who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God... 2 Thessalonians

JLB

The little horn is a king who comes up upon the beast nation with ten kings(horns) and seven heads(multitudes of peoples)
This little horn is a king in Israel who is the Antichrist and sets himself as God. He sits upon the beast nation(Assyrian) because he is in alliance with them.
The red dragon is said to sit upon the same ten horns and seven heads because the Antichrist and red dragon are the same king over Israel.

 

[LeviR]

The tribulation cannot begin amidst "peace treaties" & "Cease Fires".
It can only begin at a point that the Nation Israel appears absolutely doomed, with enemies on every side closing in for what looks like without a doubt the fulfillment of " From The River To The Sea". death to all Jews.
This is when Satan's man is revealed & comes on the scene to do what no one believed any human being could do.
All this as Bloody Biden prepares to cut the Jews loose to fend for themselves as he aligns America with Iran .
Setting the table for it all to happen Bloody Biden is .
Hezbollah now just waiting for Bloody Biden to give them the word.
Hezbollah having ten times the firepower, technology , and manpower that Hamas had.
The arrogance of this Nation believing that God does not intervene in the affairs of nations by whatever means He chooses.
This belief as we allow ourselves to be overrun up to our armpits with terrorists streaming across our border by the tens of thousands.
All the while maintaining our arrogance & pride, as our biggest concern is our basketball brackets.
We are literally begging God to make an example of us.
God took a Communist club to Germany and beat them near to death when they turned on the Jews.
God does not change , if He did it to Germany He will do it to America only with us I believe God will finish the job.


For centuries, Petra seemed secure in its unassailable fortress of rock, but today its ruins lie uninhabited, in fulfillment of the prophetic word: “‘As Sodom and Gomorrah were overthrown, along with their neighboring towns,’ says the LORD, ‘so no one will live there; no people will dwell in it’” (Jeremiah 49:18).

This is what I think will happen. The Jews will become even a greater nation in the Middle East than they already are. They will rebuild the temple in Jerusalem and begin their old form of worship including the sacrifices. Then the Antichrist will appear who claims to be God.
He will form an alliance with the Assyrian king, who I think is king of Iran
They, together will set up the abomination of desolation calling for their worship. The believers in Jerusalem will be persecuted and many killed.
The nations of whom Israel has joined herself will turn on her and bring her down.
After that, the nations who spoiled her will also be spoiled upon the mountains of Israel.
The remnant of Israel(believers)will remain and establish God’s kingdom on earth.

 

[Consecrated Life]

This is what I think will happen. The Jews will become even a greater nation in the Middle East than they already are. They will rebuild the temple in Jerusalem and

Most of what you have I agree , but I have got to ask how you figure Israel will become greater when America cuts them off and all the surrounding nations take that que to commence the attack ?
I have them with their back to the ocean when Satan's man appears to save the day .
And I believe the scripture backs up the ability of Satan's man to make "Peace" where no one thought it was possible .

 

[LeviR]

Most of what you have I agree , but I have got to ask how you figure Israel will become greater when America cuts them off and all the surrounding nations take that que to commence the attack ?
I have them with their back to the ocean when Satan's man appears to save the day .
And I believe the scripture backs up the ability of Satan's man to make "Peace" where no one thought it was possible .

I don’t think America will cut them off. Maybe they will. But I don’t think it will happen until Israel is well prepared as a significant force in the Middle East all by herself.

 

[Consecrated Life]

I don’t think America will cut them off. Maybe they will. But I don’t think it will happen until Israel is well prepared as a significant force in the Middle East all by herself.

Biden will cut Israel loose before the Democrat convention.
He can't afford to lose the Muslim vote on top of what he is losing now.
He is being told that the rest of the world despises the Jews, which is basically true , and that when they come under attack by Hezbollah and others He can blame it on their own brutal behavior, killing civilians & aid workers .
This will satisfy everyone .
In addition how do you think Satan's man will be able to dazzle the world with his incredible peacemaking powers if Israel has it under control?

 

[LeviR]

Biden will cut Israel loose before the Democrat convention.
He can't afford to lose the Muslim vote on top of what he is losing now.
He is being told that the rest of the world despises the Jews, which is basically true , and that when they come under attack by Hezbollah and others He can blame it on their own brutal behavior, killing civilians & aid workers .
This will satisfy everyone .
In addition how do you think Satan's man will be able to dazzle the world with his incredible peacemaking powers if Israel has it under control?

Those in Israel who know what is to come upon them will try to warn the people. But they will be overcome by the false prophets in Israel who will cry “Peace, Peace”. Then will come the sudden destruction.

 

[JLB]

The execution of God’s judgments take place in the land of Israel. It is when God brings His judgments first upon His people Israel and then upon the nations who have gathered in her land.
The remnant of believers in Israel are of the twelve tribes of Israel and are Jews.

Here is what the scripture teaches -

Now when the dragon saw that he had been cast to the earth, he persecuted the woman who gave birth to the male Child. But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Revelation 12:13-17

• And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

No “Jews” are mentioned.

Unless you consider “the woman” to pertain to Jews, no reference to Jews are mentioned.


The “woman” escapes the dragon because she is carried into the wilderness prepared for her where she is protected and fed for three and a half years.

• But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.

JLB

 

[JLB]

The little horn is a king who comes up upon the beast nation with ten kings(horns) and seven heads(multitudes of peoples)
This little horn is a king in Israel who is the Antichrist and sets himself as God. He sits upon the beast nation(Assyrian) because he is in alliance with them.
The red dragon is said to sit upon the same ten horns and seven heads because the Antichrist and red dragon are the same king over Israel.

Please post scripture, chapter and verse for all of these statements you have made.

 

[LeviR]

Here is what the scripture teaches -

Now when the dragon saw that he had been cast to the earth, he persecuted the woman who gave birth to the male Child. But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent. So the serpent spewed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away by the flood. But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood which the dragon had spewed out of his mouth. And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Revelation 12:13-17

• And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

No “Jews” are mentioned.

Unless you consider “the woman” to pertain to Jews, no reference to Jews are mentioned.


The “woman” escapes the dragon because she is carried into the wilderness prepared for her where she is protected and fed for three and a half years.

• But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.

JLB

A remnant shall escape.

20And it shall come to pass in that day
That the remnant of Israel,
And such as have escaped of the house of Jacob,
Will never again depend on him who [e]defeated them,
But will depend on the Lord, the Holy One of Israel, in truth.
21The remnant will return, the remnant of Jacob,
To the Mighty God.
22For though your people, O Israel, be as the sand of the sea,
A remnant of them will return;
The destruction decreed shall overflow with righteousness.
23For the Lord God of hosts
Will make a determined end
In the midst of all the land.
24Therefore thus says the Lord God of hosts: “O My people, who dwell in Zion, do not be afraid of the Assyrian. He shall strike you with a rod and lift up his staff against you, in the manner of Egypt. 25For yet a very little while and the indignation will cease, as will My anger in their destruction.” 26And the Lord of hosts will [f]stir up a scourge for him like the slaughter of Midian at the rock of Oreb; as His rod was on the sea, so will He lift it up in the manner of Egypt.

27It shall come to pass in that day
That his burden will be taken away from your shoulder,
And his yoke from your neck,
And the yoke will be destroyed because of the anointing oil. (Isa 10:20-27)

This remnant is spoken of as the 144,000 of the twelve tribes of Israel who refuse to worship the Antichrist and the beast.
When the Antichrist is tossed down from his kingship by the Assyrian he will chase after the remnant of believers. But they will escape from his hand and rely on the Lord for their help.

 

[leroy]

In 1997 something was seen in the heavens that could never have been seen prior to that time. With the introduction of a highly technical computer astronomy program called "Starry Night" you can view the canopy from any place and at any time in history. You can go to any location on the earth or moon and look in any direction to see the placement of the stars and planets.
Rev. 12 is clearly displayed in the heavens and was noted that this is obviously the time of the fulfillment of those words for we could not have known of that description if this program did not exist.
"There appeared a great wonder in the heavens" If you look at the earlier version of that program the pictures of the constellations, I believe have been divinely ordained.
In that year during the time between Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur you will see Virgo and the moon is under her feet. Also the sun is in her breast. And the picture depicts a woman who is obviously pregnant and she has wings. Underneath her is the largest constellation which covers 1/3rd of the canopy. It is a dragon called Hydra.
Who is this child? Obviously he comes out of the woman or the church. Most likely an unassuming nobody that God has found he could trust to do all his will. A simple mortal man like you or I who was anointed for the special purpose of bringing the people of God to their full and final salvation (deliverance from sin) and to prepare them for removal from this dark world without seeing death. Christ must be glorified in them to demonstrate that the devil does not have any power over God's children anymore. Their lives will be transformed by God's redeeming grace.

"Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: " Eph 4:13

They will come through a great and personal tribulation of facing their own agreements with death and nullifying them in the power of the resurrection. They will see nothing in themselves or their personal lives of the past that have any redeeming qualities. But when the Father looks at them He will see no spot or wrinkle. Thou art all far my love I see no spot in thee

 

[JLB]

A remnant shall escape.

Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and sixty days. Revelation 12:6


again


But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.
Revelation 12:14





JLB

 

[LeviR]

Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and sixty days. Revelation 12:6


again


But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time, from the presence of the serpent.
Revelation 12:14





JLB

The war upon the saints is 3.5 years.
???

 

[reddogs]

Hi LeviR

For the record, the writing is about the 'revelation' of Jesus. That begins with his birth.

God bless,
Ted

So Whom was there at Creation....

 

[miamited]

So Whom was there at Creation....

God, Jesus and God's Holy Spirit. But Jesus wasn't revealed to us, other than a very brief mention of their being a plurality of beings at the creation. The Revelation writes to us all about Jesus. It is the writing that explains to us the how and when and what of Jesus. It's purpose is to reveal to God's people, and the world, since it was written well after Jesus' gospel proclamation was sent out to the Gentiles, 'who' this Jesus is.

God bless,
Ted

 

[JLB]

The war upon the saints is 3.5 years.
???

Yes agreed.


He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time and times and half a time.
Daniel 7:25

 

[Rodger]

Now if you ask, the answer a lot of people give is that is a seven or more years at some time in the future. But the early Church was persecuted from the very beginning, first by the Jews first, then the pagan Romans, then the Papal Romans. So the Church was going through tribulation since it’s beginning, first through the persecution and crucifixion of Christ Himself, then through tribulation in relation to His Apostles, and followers and all through the Dark Ages. Now we find that the dragon or Satan was persecuting the church as soon as as it was founded by Christ and the Apostles.

Revelation 12:1-6
1And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

The man child is Christ, and the woman was the Church, during a great time of tribulation when the facts of the prophecy are examined closely.

Psalms 2:1-12
1 Why do the heathen rage, and the people imagine a vain thing? 2 The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the LORD, and against his anointed, saying, 3 Let us break their bands asunder, and cast away their cords from us. 4 He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision. 5 Then shall he speak unto them in his wrath, and vex them in his sore displeasure. 6 Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion. 7 I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee. 8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession. 9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron; thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter's vessel. 10 Be wise now therefore, O ye kings: be instructed, ye judges of the earth. 11 Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling. 12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.

Isaiah 11:1-5
1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots: 2 And the spirit of the LORD shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the LORD; 3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the LORD: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears: 4 But with righteousness shall he judge the poor, and reprove with equity for the meek of the earth: and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth, and with the breath of his lips shall he slay the wicked. 5 And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faithfulness the girdle of his reins.

Revelation 19:13-16
13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. 14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. 15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. 16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

The above scriptures are all in relation to the Lord Jesus Christ. It is He who is, and will rule the nations with a rod of iron, and there would be conflict and great tribulation up to then, which we have seen and will be till the end.

I disagree.

The man child was of course Jesus the Christ.

The woman was not the church! Jesus established the church, He did not come out of it!
The woman was the nation of Israel.