Are Christian Homosexuals saved?

[Alfred Persson]

9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
13 For "whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved." (Rom. 10:9-13 NKJ)

I think its very clear, all who call upon the name of the LORD confessing Jesus with their mouth and believing in their heart God raised Him from the dead, are saved.

Its also very clear Christians who are unrighteous, fornicators, idolators, adulterers, homosexuals, practice extortion, drunkenness, fornication, sodomites, thieves, covetous, drunkards, revilers, extortioners, will NOT enter God's Kingdom.

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Cor. 6:9-10 NKJ)

So how do we reconcile the two? How is Christ "able to save to the uttermost those who come to God through Him" (Heb. 7:25) if they continue to practice such things and then die?

Simple, they go to Hades like the Rich Man, and are purged of their slavery to sin. Only after the Spirit of Judgement and Spirit of burning has purged their slavery to sin, will they be permitted to "live according to God" eagerly awaiting the Second Coming of Christ when they will rise to meet Him in the air:

4 When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment and by the spirit of burning,
5 then the LORD will create above every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and above her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day and the shining of a flaming fire by night. For over all the glory there will be a covering. (Isa. 4:4-5 NKJ)

I will bring the one-third through the fire, Will refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them. I will say,`This is My people'; And each one will say,`The LORD is my God.'" (Zech. 13:9 NKJ)

"As for you also, Because of the blood of your covenant, I will set your prisoners free from the waterless pit. (Zech. 9:11 NKJ)

For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:6 NKJ)

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:27-10:1 NKJ)

14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. (1 Thess. 4:14-18 NKJ)

Is The Rich Man and Lazarus Story About Hell Prophecy Parable or both | End Time News, Today - Rapture Ready News

34 All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them, 35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world." (Matt. 13:34-35

endtimenews.net

 

[Alfred Persson]

The classic denial Homosexual Christians could be saved is the idea they didn't truly repent and call upon the Lord for salvation.

No doubt that is true of many who call upon the Lord, or after calling upon Him fall into being drunks, or fornicators, or idolators, or money lovers etc.

But if someone truly calls upon the LORD, they are saved. By God's grace, not by works.

So it follows from the explicit and clear teaching neither will drunks, extortioners, etc. enter God's kingdom, that they will be purged of these sins before entering.

It does appear hades accomplishes more than simply holding the dead until judgment day.



The fire of God's inspection will burn away all the dross the built on the foundation of Christ, and then they will be saved but as "through fire" as one flees a burning house:

 

[Alfred Persson]

Wow. I thought all the defenders of pronoun confusion would jump on this thread.

I should clarify, its a "thought experiment". Homosexuality is listed as equally bad with fornication, something many strait Christians are guilty of. If Homosexuals are excluded, so are they.

Whether either group are saved only God knows.

I believe they are if their conscience afflicts them for continuing in sin. But if they become reprobate, then they were never saved. They are tares sown among the wheat. But the dilemma is there for all to see, Christians are guilty of sexual sins, straight and gay. Yet few deny fornicating heterosexuals won't inherit God's kingdom.

It remains to be seen if God shares that bias. I suspect He doesn't. That no one should be deceived. In context, the ones "saved" are those who stopped committing sexual sins, and were cleansed of such unrighteousness:

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God (1 Cor. 6:9-11 NKJ)

 

[Alfred Persson]

The classic denial Homosexual Christians could be saved is the idea they didn't truly repent and call upon the Lord for salvation.

No doubt that is true of many who call upon the Lord, or after calling upon Him fall into being drunks, or fornicators, or idolators, or money lovers etc.

But if someone truly calls upon the LORD, they are saved. By God's grace, not by works.

So it follows from the explicit and clear teaching neither will drunks, extortioners, etc. enter God's kingdom, that they will be purged of these sins before entering.

It does appear hades accomplishes more than simply holding the dead until judgment day.



The fire of God's inspection will burn away all the dross the built on the foundation of Christ, and then they will be saved but as "through fire" as one flees a burning house:

10 According to the grace of God which was given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, and another builds on it. But let each one take heed how he builds on it.
11 For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw,
13 each one's work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one's work, of what sort it is.
14 If anyone's work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward.
15 If anyone's work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.
(1 Cor. 3:10-15 NKJ)

Witherington explicitly observes, “This cannot be a reference to purgatory since Paul is referring to what happens on the judgment day … after the return of Christ.… He is not referring to what happens to a person after death and before the final judgment.… ‘As through fire’ is a metaphor for escaping … by the skin of one’s teeth.”8282 Witherington, Conflict and Community, 134. Thiselton, A. C. (2000). The First Epistle to the Corinthians: a commentary on the Greek text (p. 315). W.B. Eerdmans.

 

[Josef]

Hey All,
So you are trying to bait us into an argument Alfred Perrson. I won't engage you. I will simply say you are entitled to be as wrong as you want to be.
If God saves practicing homosexuals, who call themselves Christian, He owes an apology to the cities of Sodom and Gammorah.
Keep walking everybody. May God bless,
Taz

 

[Alfred Persson]

Hey All,
So you are trying to bait us into an argument Alfred Perrson. I won't engage you. I will simply say you are entitled to be as wrong as you want to be.
If God saves practicing homosexuals, who call themselves Christian, He owes an apology to the cities of Sodom and Gammorah.
Keep walking everybody. May God bless,
Taz

There are two assumptions in your reply that, if we discussed them, likely would prove we agree.
1) That God saves practicing homosexuals. I agree He doesn't. No willful enemy of God or His righteousness has a share in God's Kingdom.

He saves sinners, and the Holy Spirit changes them from being drunks, fornicators, adulterers, extortionists, sodomites, homosexuals etc, into people who "once did those things but now have repented:

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. (1 Cor. 6:9-11 NKJ)

But what of those who aren't "willful". What of the adulterer or fornicator that can't stop? Some even claim they were "born that way". I am in no position to judge, what do I know?

I do know everyone should repent, and beg God liberate them from the sin so they can be like the Corinthians who once did those things, but were "washed...sanctified...justified in the name of the Lord Jesus" by God's Spirit.

When I cried out to Jesus for salvation, I stopped doing all the sins I was aware of. But over 40 years of being born again, I have repeatedly learned I was guilty of a lot more, just was't aware of it:

For I know nothing against myself, yet I am not justified by this; but He who judges me is the Lord. (1 Cor. 4:4 NKJ)

Many have been taught, by people they trust, that God saves everyone who comes to Him, and He cleanses them on His own time schedule. Do you agree with that?

I'm not sure I do, but admit who am I to really know?

So I leave it to God, warn people of Paul's words. I do know, those who willfully reject God and His righteousness, have no share in the Kingdom to come.

 

[Anaphora]

Good job ALFRED , good documentation.
First Corinthians 6;9 to 6;20 . Homosexuals will not inherit kingdom of God. They will go to Sheol.
Reprobates go with satan into lake of fire, revelation chapter 20.
Psalm chapter 37.
Romans chapter 1.
Psalm chapter 73.
Were talking about reprobates.

 

[Riven]

There are so many inconsistencies regarding gay people in the Christian community. It's not a "lifestyle", and they don't choose to be gay, just as people don't choose to be straight.

Therefore, I think sending these people to hell after they die is monstrous. A deity that is this petty would be incapable of creating a universe such as ours. It's equivalent to saying short people just aren't tall enough to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Imagine if the bible said being straight was a sin. Would you turn gay to avoid sinning? Let's say you were able to do this. Would you be happy in this situation? Would your partner feel happy knowing that you're not physically attracted to them?

It sounds like the recipe for a very stressful and unfulfilling life. And yet, this is exactly what Christians are demanding that gay people endure in order to be saved.

In the end, many of these people turn away from Christianity. In a time when conversions and church attendance are rapidly declining, no less. But instead of doing some introspection on what their religion teaches and how it's having a negative effect on the faith's future, they double down and become even more isolated and extreme.

Watch this video and ask yourself, is this an accurate reflection of the character of Jesus Christ?

 

[Alfred Persson]

There are so many inconsistencies regarding gay people in the Christian community. It's not a "lifestyle", and they don't choose to be gay, just as people don't choose to be straight.

Therefore, I think sending these people to hell after they die is monstrous. A deity that is this petty would be incapable of creating a universe such as ours. It's equivalent to saying short people just aren't tall enough to enter the kingdom of heaven.

Imagine if the bible said being straight was a sin. Would you turn gay to avoid sinning? Let's say you were able to do this. Would you be happy in this situation? Would your partner feel happy knowing that you're not physically attracted to them?

It sounds like the recipe for a very stressful and unfulfilling life. And yet, this is exactly what Christians are demanding that gay people endure in order to be saved.

In the end, many of these people turn away from Christianity. In a time when conversions and church attendance are rapidly declining, no less. But instead of doing some introspection on what their religion teaches and how it's having a negative effect on the faith's future, they double down and become even more isolated and extreme.

Watch this video and ask yourself, is this an accurate reflection of the character of Jesus Christ?

Your premise hell is for punishment only, leads to a false conclusion and wrongfully condemns God when in fact He is doing everything possible to save homosexuals and fornicators and idolators and drunks etc.

Homosexuality is no worse than heterosexual fornication, both keep committed practitioners out of the kingdom of God:

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Cor. 6:9-10 NKJ)

Hell is the last chance to repent, be purged of the darkness that prevents the God from allowing the sinner into His presence.

God can't change who He is, He is unchanging. He is light and darkness cannot dwell with Him; light destroys darkness organically, its the very nature of light to banish darkness into the nether regions.

If anyone practicing darkness wants to live with God, it is THEY who must change. God cannot and will not.

God gives everyone in Hell, who did not in full knowledge and will reject Him, the chance to repent and be saved. First He liberates them from the power of sin, the fire of God's inspection burns it out of them. Then, when all self-delusion about sin is removed, the gospel is preached so the can repent and live according to God in the Spirit:

4 When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment and by the spirit of burning,
5 then the LORD will create above every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and above her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day and the shining of a flaming fire by night. For over all the glory there will be a covering.
6 And there will be a tabernacle for shade in the daytime from the heat, for a place of refuge, and for a shelter from storm and rain. (Isa. 4:4-5:1 NKJ)

God wants everyone to be saved and goes the extra mile trying to make that happen.

But He will not violate free will. If a sinner rejects the gospel in full knowledge and will, there is no "second chance." They had their chance. But all who repent of things God simply cannot allow into His presence, can be saved in the name of Jesus, the only name whereby salvation is possible:

For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:6 NKJ)

Go here for more:

Is The Rich Man and Lazarus Story About Hell Prophecy Parable or both | End Time News, Today - Rapture Ready News

34 All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them, 35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world." (Matt. 13:34-35

endtimenews.net

 

[Riven]

Your premise hell is for punishment only, leads to a false conclusion and wrongfully condemns God when in fact He is doing everything possible to save homosexuals and fornicators and idolators and drunks etc.

If the goal is to save as many people as possible, then why not just forgive mankind? I can forgive people without requiring anything in return. Are you saying God cannot do this?

 

[Hopeful 2]

9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame."
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
13 For "whoever calls on the name of the LORD shall be saved." (Rom. 10:9-13 NKJ)

I think its very clear, all who call upon the name of the LORD confessing Jesus with their mouth and believing in their heart God raised Him from the dead, are saved.

Its also very clear Christians who are unrighteous, fornicators, idolators, adulterers, homosexuals, practice extortion, drunkenness, fornication, sodomites, thieves, covetous, drunkards, revilers, extortioners, will NOT enter God's Kingdom.

9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. (1 Cor. 6:9-10 NKJ)

So how do we reconcile the two? How is Christ "able to save to the uttermost those who come to God through Him" (Heb. 7:25) if they continue to practice such things and then die?

Simple, they go to Hades like the Rich Man, and are purged of their slavery to sin. Only after the Spirit of Judgement and Spirit of burning has purged their slavery to sin, will they be permitted to "live according to God" eagerly awaiting the Second Coming of Christ when they will rise to meet Him in the air:

4 When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment and by the spirit of burning,
5 then the LORD will create above every dwelling place of Mount Zion, and above her assemblies, a cloud and smoke by day and the shining of a flaming fire by night. For over all the glory there will be a covering. (Isa. 4:4-5 NKJ)

I will bring the one-third through the fire, Will refine them as silver is refined, And test them as gold is tested. They will call on My name, And I will answer them. I will say,`This is My people'; And each one will say,`The LORD is my God.'" (Zech. 13:9 NKJ)

"As for you also, Because of the blood of your covenant, I will set your prisoners free from the waterless pit. (Zech. 9:11 NKJ)

For this reason the gospel was preached also to those who are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. (1 Pet. 4:6 NKJ)

27 And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. (Heb. 9:27-10:1 NKJ)

14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first.
17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
18 Therefore comfort one another with these words. (1 Thess. 4:14-18 NKJ)

Is The Rich Man and Lazarus Story About Hell Prophecy Parable or both | End Time News, Today - Rapture Ready News

34 All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them, 35 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying: "I will open My mouth in parables; I will utter things kept secret from the foundation of the world." (Matt. 13:34-35

endtimenews.net

As long as their repentance from acting on temptations is true, they can count on finding their names in the book of life.
Same goes for liars, adulterers, arsonists, drunks, thieves, child molesters, drug addicts, kidnappers, etc.
If any of the above returns to his sin, he shows he was never reborn of God's seed. (1 John 3:9-10)...and will be lost.

 

[Br4nd0n]

Just going off the title... If someone who is gay repents of their sexual proclivity, and lives a life that is closely in step with the Holy Spirit, then yes, they are saved. In just the same way liars are saved after they repent. Thieves. Murderers. Take your pick, all the same.

 

[Josef]

Hey All,
I am saying we to submit to God's requirements, not man's.

Matthew 5:46-48 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?
Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

Matthew 9:11-13 And when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto his disciples, Why eateth your Master with publicans and sinners?
But when Jesus heard that, he said unto them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick.
But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

One must turn from the their sin; which is what repentance means. We stop doing what we know is sin.

 

[Alfred Persson]

If the goal is to save as many people as possible, then why not just forgive mankind? I can forgive people without requiring anything in return. Are you saying God cannot do this?

Suppose you are deciding whether to forgive a dangerous person and then allow him to move into your children's bedroom, and once you make the decision you can't change your mind or move your children to safety.

Would you forgive someone who is still dangerous to your children? O would you insist he is completely changed and no threat to your children before you forgive?

 

[evenifigoalone]

I'm gay. Affirming, unaffirming, I'm not going to specify. I'm tired of being "one of the good ones". I'm also so tired of being the subject of this stupid discourse, as if I'm a thought experiment and not a person.
For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”

Don't quote me, I will not respond or even take a look. I'm tired and cranky and overstimulated as all heck this week.

 

[Josef]

Sorry hit send before I was finished. Let me finish my thought.

Matthew 12:41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Luke 13:1-3 There were present at that season some that told him of the Galilaeans, whose blood Pilate had mingled with their sacrifices.
And Jesus answering said unto them, Suppose ye that these Galilaeans were sinners above all the Galilaeans, because they suffered such things?
I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

Repentance is necessary part of salvation. It does not mean you can willfully continue in your sin. Repentance means to turn away, to go in the opposite direction. We must accept that once we are forgiven, we must turn. That is part of why the Holy Spirit indwells us, to lead us and guide to righteousness.

For some people, they can repent and never perform the sin again. To them I say praise God. It gives me hope that I can get to a place like that. For others like myself, I have struggled with a particular sin since I was old enough to commit the sin. I received Jesus when I was four. So I completely understood what I was doing was sin. I knew I was accountable for my actions.I regretted it afterwards, would ask for forgiveness afterwards. But when the opportunity arose, and my willpower was low I would commit the sin again. To be fair, I have not committed the sin I am referring to in over two years. So praise God maybe I do have it under control. I have repented and have completely turned.

I said all of that to make you understand I have not had the easy life vis-a-vis sin. I know I am saved by grace through faith in Jesus.. I know God loves me. There is joy in my heart that never goes away, except when I sin. And as soon as I ask for forgiveness, it returns. I know that Jesus will never leave me nor forsake me even though I am the scum of the earth. I am the sinner Jesus died to save.

"As long as their repentance from acting on temptations is true, they can count on finding their names in the book of life.
Same goes for liars, adulterers, arsonists, drunks, thieves, child molesters, drug addicts, kidnappers, etc.
If any of the above returns to his sin, he shows he was never reborn of God's seed. (1 John 3:9-10)...and will be lost." Quote from Br4ndon

I agree with you Br4ndon True repentance is the key that unlocks the joy in my heart.

"Suppose you are deciding whether to forgive a dangerous person and then allow him to move into your children's bedroom, and once you make the decision you can't change your mind or move your children to safety.

Would you forgive someone who is still dangerous to your children? O would you insist he is completely changed and no threat to your children before you forgive?" Quote from Alfred Person.

It is my Christian duty to forgive and not judge that forgiveness. I also have a duty to guard my child. When I prioritize my duties, Jesus

 

[Josef]

Did it again. Anyway as I was saying Alfred Person, Jesus knows my child comes first among my earthly responsibilities.So no I would not leave my child in the same room as a murderer. If that is considered a lack of faith, so be it. My number one priority is my child; always has, always will be. I don't have to be stupid or ignorant about the pedophile's sin.

 

[Josef]

You all know what happened.
Keep walking everybody.
May God, bless,
Taz

 

[Riven]

Suppose you are deciding whether to forgive a dangerous person and then allow him to move into your children's bedroom, and once you make the decision you can't change your mind or move your children to safety.

Would you forgive someone who is still dangerous to your children? O would you insist he is completely changed and no threat to your children before you forgive?

How is this relevant? Why can't you just answer the question?

 

[Alfred Persson]

How is this relevant? Why can't you just answer the question?

I did answer, proving your objection without merit. God demands repentance, He cannot change who He is, Light. If a person insists on darkness, God cannot abide with him, he will be cast out of God's presence.