College Education.....Overrated?

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Data is starting to show us that the number of people for whom college is a bad deal financially is significant and growing. The New York Times reports the remarkable fact that student loan debt exceeded credit card debt for the first time last year and is about to head north of a trillion dollars. Yet even with this data in mind, we are still preaching the necessity of being college educated. My question is this, are the advantages of a college education overhyped in order to keep institutions of higher learned rolling in billions upon billions of dollars while they indoctrinate our kids AGAINST even the existence of God mind you? Should we not be more selective in terms of WHO we advise to go to college and why has the value of having a skill at a specific trade been devalued over time? To me, college has become a tool of those who control society to keep the masses dependent upon the system that controls.

 

[Pizzaguy]

To me, college has become a tool of those who control society to keep the masses dependent upon the system that controls.

Think again. A college education is a key to independence, not dependence.

I have a friend with a Master's in geology. He started off in the oil business, he's worked in various parts of healthcare - and now works in IT. He is now in his early 50's, has never been laid off or unemployed and has amassed a small fortune.

I have another friend with a Bachelor's in History. He cleans pools for a living and at the age of 49, lives in a room in an elderly ladies' home.

The difference between these two men? Not their degrees, it's their character and work ethic. A good character, a good work ethic and a college degree is an unstoppable combination.

 

[God&DogGirl]

Well that's one reason I dropped college and am now learning dog grooming. I hated the experience! It was expensive, I didn't feel like I was getting anything out of it, and I was miserable. Three good reasons to drop. I don't like the college hype either. It's really not worth it.

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Think again. A college education is a key to independence, not dependence.

I have a friend with a Master's in geology. He started off in the oil business, he's worked in various parts of healthcare - and now works in IT. He is now in his early 50's, has never been laid off or unemployed and has amassed a small fortune.

I have another friend with a Bachelor's in History. He cleans pools for a living and at the age of 49, lives in a room in an elderly ladies' home.

The difference between these two men? Not their degrees, it's their character and work ethic. A good character, a good work ethic and a college degree is an unstoppable combination.

A good work ethic and being able to offer a service that people require and need is just as good if not a better combo IMO. I will not debate your assessment of your friends, but I will point out that the degree one pursues in college makes a world of difference. Certain degrees almost certainly "pay off" while many others do NOT lead to immediate employment or do NOT lead to the type of pay that grads would have expected to make upon joining the workforce.
The fact is that as the costs of college rises, people who attend accumulate more debt at higher interest rates than in years gone by as well, and many degrees do NOT lead to employment.

Don't confuse what I am saying because I do not believe college should be avoided like the plague. I do believe that much like marriage, it should not be entered into unadvisedly, lightly, or without prior planning and direction. It should be a means to an end, not just something one does because they finish high school.

I know countless people who started but never finished their college education and decades later a still paying the bill for it. Most, not all, but most have managed to find decent work because they learned a specific skill or trade after they quit college. These people would have payed anything for someone to share with them the cons of 'just going to college to go.' I personally am degreed, but I do not work in the field that I went to school for and the career have have, I could have gotten without a college degree. (I'm a finanial advisor, and for a fact, many if not most bankers and FA's are NOT degreed. Just an FYI).

 

[tim-from-pa]

I predict that college is going to be the "next major expense" likened unto medical expenses--- the costs are getting astronomical (can you say employer mandated college insurance? ). In a sense, it's a (liberal bent) racket where they feel they have to corral most everyone through and some people aren't college material. This, in turn, scales down the impressiveness of any degree any longer. It used to be that having an associate years ago made one a cut above most workers and was adequate to classify someone as being "skilled" in a certain discipline, thus a better wage. Now, even a bachelor's degree does not seem to carry that much weight any longer as proportionally speaking I see gen x and y getting less income with their bachelor's degree than I did with my technical associate degree when I was younger.

That being said, I agree with pizzaguy that education is still important, and if one can afford it (and has the time) they should go all the way to masters or even doctorate degrees. That and a good work ethic will help get one ahead. This is especially true in the sciences and technology.

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Here's an interesting NYTimes article http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/education/edlife/09books-t.html?_r=1.

I agree that education is important and it will always be, but what we need not do is have tunnel vision when it comes to what we recognize as education. College is NOT the only way for one to be educated and for some, it may not even be the best way to be educated. The myth IMO is that college is for everybody. The college education is but A SINGLE FORM OF EDUCATION and it should not be looked at as the be all end all. It may in fact be suitable for many, BUT NOT ALL. Like anything else in life one must look at the opportunity cost or as Jesus put it, count the cost of one's endevor. A person should ask themselves these questions BEFORE enrolling in college:

1. What is the end result I desire from college (be specific)?
2. Am I committed to finishing?
3. How much will it cost me in expenses?
4. What will it cost me in time lost from earnings i could be making in the 5 years I attend?
5. Am I majoring in something that will pretty much guarantee me employment?
6. Is my major a stable field?
7. What is my passion?
8. Will the college experience feed into my passion?

 

[handy]

I'm in agreement with you T/T...while having a college education does increase the overall earning potential, it's not for everyone. My husband and one brother-in-law have college degrees, neither are working in the field for which they received their degree and both earn essentially the same as my brother and my other brother-in-law who are skilled workers...my brother does cabinets and my brother-in-law is a master flooring installer...actually he is the one who earns the most.

I want my kids to have this: The education and skills they need to pursue the careers they desire. For my daughter, who wants to own her own restaurant one of these days...she'll most likely be able to obtain that via the high school she will be attending which has a course in culinary arts and a restaurant management course. Upon graduating, she will have the ability to go into restaurant management positions, but if she chooses to go onto college, she may. However, we know several restaurant owners, neither have college degrees...success in the restaurant field usually comes via working in the field.

My son is only 11 and right now has his sights set on being a Navy Seal, which would be excellent, if that is what he sticks with. We'll see.

I think the questions to ask are great questions, especially counting the cost. Too many young people are graduating college with stupendous debt and no way to get the employment needed to start paying it down. Sometimes, all a college education gets one is a lifetime of debt. College should be like everything else in life, a carefully thought out choice weighing the benefits with the drawbacks, and there are most definitely drawbacks to college.

 

[Mike]

I personally am degreed, but I do not work in the field that I went to school for and the career have have, I could have gotten without a college degree. (I'm a finanial advisor, and for a fact, many if not most bankers and FA's are NOT degreed. Just an FYI).

What careers literally require that you have a college degree for you to perform? Some, maybe, but most only require that you have a degree, because the bar has been raised to that point. Simple supply & demand. If someone is competing for a position with college grads and s/he does not have a degree, s/he better know someone on the inside pretty well. I've never had a job that couldn't be performed by anyone with enough training, but the standard was a college degree. If you didn't have one, you'd never have the chance to prove you could.

I would say there are a number of things students can do to reduce the bloated cost of college. As a financial adviser, I'm sure you would know. Stay home and do the first two years at a community college. Do the other 2 by commuting to one if possible. It's still expensive and will require loans in most cases, but it doesn't have to cost what a 4-year packaged school will cost. I would think community colleges will see huge upturns compared to their 4-year counterparts.

Ideally, this is what I think should happen... High school kids should take a few years to really think about what they would like to pursue in a career. How many college students switch majors or never go into the field they studied? After a few years, they could assess the market, know better what they want to do, determine if a degree will be required in the short and long term, and then go or not go. Depending on what someone wants to do, unfortunately college may be the only way. But even with all the garbage thrown in, it's still education that can't be taken away at the very least.

 

[theLords]

I love College! I've never had more fun in my educational life. Praise God, my entire next 2 semesters are completely paid for (including books). Thanks to God, I have no college debt

 

[Pard]

And that's why I go to community college.

Full time student, no financial aid, I pay $1000 per semester and that covers 18 credit hours, and all those fees they tack on.

At the current time the school can only grant associate degrees, however they plan on offering bachelor degrees within the next four years. Heck, all the state colleges (UCONN, CCSU, ECSU, SCSU, and WCSU) let you take your classes at any of the local community colleges instead. My friend is going to CCSU and he has his entire four years planned out, and not once does he actually have to go to CCSU for class because all his classes are being taught at the community college in town.

But yes,I agree. College degrees are overrated for lots of people. And it's a shame that not having one is becoming a social stigma. My grandfather never had one and yet he help revolutionize the financial planning market. My great grandfather never had one and yet he invented what is now the leaf spring (used in many cars).

I was considering the idea of going to a technical school and learning a trade, and I found that I was being mocked for not going to a college. The last laugh is with those who do attend the technical schools (like my buddy who is going to a school to be a plumber) because statistically they make more money than a guy with a masters degree.

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Good points Mike. There is no doubt that a college degree has value, but the issue that needs to come into focus for parent and kids nearing the college age is: What value does college hold for me specifically? It truly is a case by case and personal decision that individuals must make.

College in my mind has become less about educating and producing productive members of society than it has about being profitable, and very profitable at that. If one looks back over the last couple decabes and at some of the degree palns that have been added, one will see courses of study that in no way prepare students for the workforce being more and more prevailent.

One thing that has always been a head stratcher for me is that so many successful entrepreneurs quite college mid way through.

 

[Pizzaguy]

One thing that has always been a head stratcher for me is that so many successful entrepreneurs quite college mid way through.

This brings up a point of mine: If you work for yourself, college seems more optional.

If you plan to work for someone else, college seems necessary - certainly so in the corporate and gov't world where the degree holds great importance.

 

[jackkerouac]

What frustrates me is how much college has been dumbed down. Even Masters programs are being dumbed down. I am thankful that the masters program I was in refused to compromise standards of achievement. I have over the past several years proof-read papers written by masters level students and have been appalled at the lack of basic knowledge of grammar and composition! I think that college and universities have more and more become glorified trade schools, and that's been the root of the problem.

Myself, I made some pretty bad decisions around paying for grad school. So I'm not sure it will ever pay off financially. But $$$ is not the only pay-off. I have job options and opportunities to do things that interest me. I also have an education. And I'm one of those classic weirdos who believe education for education's sake is valid and valuable.

 

[Mike]

What frustrates me is how much college has been dumbed down. Even Masters programs are being dumbed down. I am thankful that the masters program I was in refused to compromise standards of achievement. I have over the past several years proof-read papers written by masters level students and have been appalled at the lack of basic knowledge of grammar and composition! I think that college and universities have more and more become glorified trade schools, and that's been the root of the problem.

This is where I start sounding old. I think there is a general lack of diligence in writing that transcends school or curriculum. I went through an MBA program about 18 years ago, and their wasn't much writing involved at all. But I don't believe many people pay attention to detail with writing like they used to. My teenage children don't. Even with Microsoft Word, having all the Spell-Check and Grammar-Check, red squiggly lines, blue squiggly lines, auto-correct, etc., they still cannot write in complete sentences! How does someone get done writing a paper, see all those lines and not think they should do something about it? And these kids are virtually straight-A's!

Truth over Tradition, I would think our system of higher education is going to have a complete overhaul soon. It seems inevitable. How can the system absorb all the increases. People are struggling to maintain their current income if they aren't losing it, yet colleges are hiking their tuition seemingly every year! I can't imagine how they justify that! In the end, this puts a strain on the tax payers who feed the system that is needing to provide loans to more and more people. I've heard solutions suggested that are very radical but might prove to work. One was for the state to pay for every person who need a college education. Upon death, the government would get X percentage of their estate (I think it was something like 20%). There would be no financial hole to crawl out of, and the very wealthy would make up for all those who die broke. The only problem, which is huge, is front-ending the finance of this. It would be decades before the program started funding itself.

 

[tim-from-pa]

And another thing.... No matter how much education one has, one does not make much money as a Gnomonist.

Well, maybe if one is fortunate enough to work in the Queen's royal garden ---- that's the exception.

 

[TRUTH over TRADITION]

Is college a worthwhile investment for most people?

 

[farouk]

Is college a worthwhile investment for most people?

If the course can be sanctified to the believer...

 

[jasoncran]

I no longer with In the field I pursued.