Is Christ coming in our life time or is it history

[Hope of glory]

When you see the words "coming" "revealing" "appearing" of the Lord, all you think is future.

All future as the scriptures teach.


He will be seen when He returns, hence the word appear!

Every eye will see Him!

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.

There is no explaing away this scripture.

When He returns, He will gather all His people unto the resurrection.


JLB

JLB, I have already addressed "the Spirit" of Heb.9:28. Search out word "appear" in the Greek and you will see that your 1 deminsional interpretation is lacking. We must see what is written by the Spirit, and not just by the letter.

Can you please also address this point which you have ignored 3 times.
The word "hereafter" in Math.26:64 is "apo arti" and means (from now, from this moment)
Jesus told Ciaphas "hereafter" (from now on, from this moment) you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power and coming in the clouds of heaven"
He was not speaking of a "future event"

Also, show ms one scripture where Ciaphas sees a vision, or a spiritual revelation of the "coming of the Lord". If you can't, than your claims are in fact just "hypothetical"

Thanks

 

[JLB]

When you see the words "coming" "revealing" "appearing" of the Lord, all you think is future.

All future as the scriptures teach.


He will be seen when He returns, hence the word appear!

Every eye will see Him!

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.

There is no explaing away this scripture.

When He returns, He will gather all His people unto the resurrection.


JLB

JLB, I have already addressed "the Spirit" of Heb.9:28. Search out word "appear" in the Greek and you will see that your 1 deminsional interpretation is lacking. We must see what is written by the Spirit, and not just by the letter.

Can you please also address this point which you have ignored 3 times.
The word "hereafter" in Math.26:64 is "apo arti" and means (from now, from this moment)
Jesus told Ciaphas "hereafter" (from now on, from this moment) you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power and coming in the clouds of heaven"
He was not speaking of a "future event"

Also, show ms one scripture where Ciaphas sees a vision, or a spiritual revelation of the "coming of the Lord". If you can't, than your claims are in fact just "hypothetical"

Thanks

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

The meaning is clear, and therefore meant to teach us and renew our mind to the truth.

The truth is Jesus will appear a second time, once and for all.

He will sit on His throne of Glory and All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

We will have met Him in the air and we will forever be with Him.

He will reign and rule on earth as it is in heaven!


6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, 8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed.2 Thessalonians 1:6-10

That Day is something for all of us to look forward to!


JLB

 

[endtimesdeut32/70AD]

How many times has Jesus ascended?

One time.

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

 

[JLB]

How many times has Jesus ascended?

One time.

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

Go ahead and show me from the scriptures, where Jesus ascended in the clouds and returned in the clouds.

9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel... Acts 1:9-10

This is the one where He ascended into heaven in the clouds.

Where are the others you speak of?



JLB

 

[Deborah13]

How many times has Jesus ascended?

One time.

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

Good point and I agree. It's clear from what He said and did later that He ascended to the Father, in between.

 

[JLB]

How many times has Jesus ascended?

One time.

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

Good point and I agree. It's clear from what He said and did later that He ascended to the Father, in between.

Please show me from the scriptures, where Jesus ascended in the clouds and returned in the clouds.

I find this one.

9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel... Acts 1:9-10


JLB

 

[Deborah13]

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

Good point and I agree. It's clear from what He said and did later that He ascended to the Father, in between.

Please show me from the scriptures, where Jesus ascended in the clouds and returned in the clouds.

I find this one.

9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel... Acts 1:9-10


JLB

JLB, I didn't say that He ascended into a cloud as at the transfiguration. I was responding to a response, that we can see in scripture where Jesus also ascended in John 20. So that is clearly two. We don't know how that happened in John 20 whether it be into a cloud or not, it doesn't say.

 

[JLB]

what about the time he said to mary; dont touch me for I have not yet ascended to the father. later in the day he ate with them and likely exchanged hugs with them. This is the asvension I see in Dan 7.

There may have been sevaral ascensions into the clouds or vanishings and reappearings.

Good point and I agree. It's clear from what He said and did later that He ascended to the Father, in between.

Please show me from the scriptures, where Jesus ascended in the clouds and returned in the clouds.

I find this one.

9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel... Acts 1:9-10


JLB

JLB, I didn't say that He ascended into a cloud as at the transfiguration. I was responding to a response, that we can see in scripture where Jesus also ascended in John 20. So that is clearly two. We don't know how that happened in John 20 whether it be into a cloud or not, it doesn't say.

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

Jesus left this earth, as recorded by Acts 1:9-11, in a cloud, He will appear a second time, as recorded by Hebrews 9:28, for Salvation.

This is what the scriptures teach.

This is the truth.


JLB

 

[Hope of glory]

When you see the words "coming" "revealing" "appearing" of the Lord, all you think is future.

All future as the scriptures teach.

He will be seen when He returns, hence the word appear!

Every eye will see Him!

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation.

There is no explaing away this scripture.

When He returns, He will gather all His people unto the resurrection.


JLB

JLB, I have already addressed "the Spirit" of Heb.9:28. Search out word "appear" in the Greek and you will see that your 1 deminsional interpretation is lacking. We must see what is written by the Spirit, and not just by the letter.

Can you please also address this point which you have ignored 3 times.
The word "hereafter" in Math.26:64 is "apo arti" and means (from now, from this moment)
Jesus told Ciaphas "hereafter" (from now on, from this moment) you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power and coming in the clouds of heaven"

He was not speaking of a "future event"

Also, show ms one scripture where Ciaphas sees a vision, or a spiritual revelation of the "coming of the Lord". If you can't, than your claims are in fact just "hypothetical"

Thanks

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

The meaning is clear, and therefore meant to teach us and renew our mind to the truth.

The truth is Jesus will appear a second time, once and for all.

He will sit on His throne of Glory and All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

We will have met Him in the air and we will forever be with Him.

He will reign and rule on earth as it is in heaven!


6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,
8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed.2 Thessalonians 1:6-10

That Day is something for all of us to look forward to!

JLB

JLB, why did you nof address the language "apo arti" in Math..26:64?
Why did you not show me a scripture where Ciaphas saw Jesus' second coming in a vision or by the Spirit?
Were your arguments actually only hypothetical?

10 "when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints"
....."IN his saints...."
He is and will be glorified IN us, because Christ is IN us!
That Day has come my friend, Arise, and allow Him to be glorified in you!

 

[Hope of glory]

Ummm. Seems the issue is with chopping the last week of Danial up to say things will come to pass that have already come to pass.
but coming at 70Ad? I think that would be after Paul 60 ad? I am trying to understand this, but would like a scripture of His coming and what He did after 70ad. I agree the Kingdom of God is now here, I agree Jesus returned after his resurrection because I have scriptures. I need the 70ad events of what Jesus did while here.

Mike.

Brother Mike

I was just going over your post again, you may be misunderstanding me.
I do not believe that Jesus physically and bodily returned in 70ad.

On another note, have you reviewed my Luke 21 reasoning.
Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?
One generation could not possibly witness both the destruction of Jerusalem (70ad) and his still future return (2 events, nearly 2000 years apart). Do tou agree?
Therefore, his "coming in the clouds" can't possibly refer to his future return as traditional teaching has assumed.
What are your thoughts?

Thanks brother

 

[Brother Mike]

On another note, have you reviewed my Luke 21 reasoning.
Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?
One generation could not possibly witness both the destruction of Jerusalem (70ad) and his still future return (2 events, nearly 2000 years apart). Do tou agree?
Therefore, his "coming in the clouds" can't possibly refer to his future return as traditional teaching has assumed.
What are your thoughts?

I just read on the forums that the rapture is a Computer thing were each person is stored on the gov computers and the Ipod gets taken or something. Very interesting theory to say the least.

Luke 21:

Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?

I believe so. This generation would denote a specific one.

One generation could not possibly witness both the destruction of Jerusalem (70ad) and his still future return (2 events, nearly 2000 years apart). Do tou agree?

I think that women threw her mites in a bit hard and must have cracked the foundation of the temple. It might have crumbled a few days later.

The issue with the passage is what time did it all happen, or has it? People like to read the bible as if they have not missed something yet. Was Jesus comparison to the temple and stones related to the stones the builders rejected in Peter being a metaphor?

This generation that will see these things. Earthquakes in pre selected populated places (Topos) That happen yet? To come.

You need to give me more here. I half of it past? Some future? Jesus had a way to just tell us what is going to happen, Minus the time line.

Fill me in.

If the temple fell, the Lady with the Mites is to blame. I got that much figured out.

Blessings.

Mike.

 

[JLB]

JLB, I have already addressed "the Spirit" of Heb.9:28. Search out word "appear" in the Greek and you will see that your 1 deminsional interpretation is lacking. We must see what is written by the Spirit, and not just by the letter.

Can you please also address this point which you have ignored 3 times.
The word "hereafter" in Math.26:64 is "apo arti" and means (from now, from this moment)
Jesus told Ciaphas "hereafter" (from now on, from this moment) you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power and coming in the clouds of heaven"

He was not speaking of a "future event"

Also, show ms one scripture where Ciaphas sees a vision, or a spiritual revelation of the "coming of the Lord". If you can't, than your claims are in fact just "hypothetical"

Thanks

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

The meaning is clear, and therefore meant to teach us and renew our mind to the truth.

The truth is Jesus will appear a second time, once and for all.

He will sit on His throne of Glory and All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

We will have met Him in the air and we will forever be with Him.

He will reign and rule on earth as it is in heaven!


6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,
8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed.2 Thessalonians 1:6-10

That Day is something for all of us to look forward to!

JLB

JLB, why did you nof address the language "apo arti" in Math..26:64?
Why did you not show me a scripture where Ciaphas saw Jesus' second coming in a vision or by the Spirit?
Were your arguments actually only hypothetical?

10 "when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints"
....."IN his saints...."
He is and will be glorified IN us, because Christ is IN us!
That Day has come my friend, Arise, and allow Him to be glorified in you!

When you post the scripture that pertains to Jesus Christ Coming at the end of the age to gather His Church.

JLB

 

[Hope of glory]

On another note, have you reviewed my Luke 21 reasoning.
Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?
One generation could not possibly witness both the destruction of Jerusalem (70ad) and his still future return (2 events, nearly 2000 years apart). Do tou agree?
Therefore, his "coming in the clouds" can't possibly refer to his future return as traditional teaching has assumed.
What are your thoughts?

I just read on the forums that the rapture is a Computer thing were each person is stored on the gov computers and the Ipod gets taken or something. Very interesting theory to say the least.

Luke 21:

Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?

I believe so. This generation would denote a specific one.

One generation could not possibly witness both the destruction of Jerusalem (70ad) and his still future return (2 events, nearly 2000 years apart). Do tou agree?

I think that women threw her mites in a bit hard and must have cracked the foundation of the temple. It might have crumbled a few days later.

The issue with the passage is what time did it all happen, or has it? People like to read the bible as if they have not missed something yet. Was Jesus comparison to the temple and stones related to the stones the builders rejected in Peter being a metaphor?

This generation that will see these things. Earthquakes in pre selected populated places (Topos) That happen yet? To come.

You need to give me more here. I half of it past? Some future? Jesus had a way to just tell us what is going to happen, Minus the time line.

Fill me in.

If the temple fell, the Lady with the Mites is to blame. I got that much figured out.

Blessings.

Mike.

Brother Mike

You said:" Was Jesus comparison to the temple and stones related to the stones the builders rejected in Peter being a metaphor? "
Answer: No sir
Mark 13:1-2 "And as he went out of the temple, one of his disciples saith unto him, Master, see what manner of STONES are here. And Jesus answering said unto him, Seest thou these GREAT BUILDINGS? There shall not be left one stone upon another that shall not be thrown down"
The context reveals "literal stones" of the literal city of Jerusalem.

You also said "Do you agree that the phrase "this generation" refers to a single (one) generation?
I believe so. This generation would denote a specific one.

So I ask you again, how can "a specific generation" (one single generation) see both Jerusalems destruction in 70ad and Jesus' future "coming in the clouds" (2 events nearly 2000 years apart and counting)?
Is the first century generation still alive?

You said: "You need to give me more here. I half of it past? Some future? Jesus had a way to just tell us what is going to happen, Minus the time line. "
Brother Mike, he gave the time line......"this generation" (40 years)

Question: what do you see as "past" and what do you see as "future" in Luke 21?

Blessings

 

[Hope of glory]

JLB, I have already addressed "the Spirit" of Heb.9:28. Search out word "appear" in the Greek and you will see that your 1 deminsional interpretation is lacking. We must see what is written by the Spirit, and not just by the letter.

Can you please also address this point which you have ignored 3 times.
The word "hereafter" in Math.26:64 is "apo arti" and means (from now, from this moment)
Jesus told Ciaphas "hereafter" (from now on, from this moment) you will see the Son of Man sitting on the right hand of power and coming in the clouds of heaven"

He was not speaking of a "future event"

Also, show ms one scripture where Ciaphas sees a vision, or a spiritual revelation of the "coming of the Lord". If you can't, than your claims are in fact just "hypothetical"

Thanks

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

The meaning is clear, and therefore meant to teach us and renew our mind to the truth.

The truth is Jesus will appear a second time, once and for all.

He will sit on His throne of Glory and All the nations will be gathered before Him, and He will separate them one from another, as a shepherd divides his sheep from the goats.

We will have met Him in the air and we will forever be with Him.

He will reign and rule on earth as it is in heaven!


6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,
8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed.2 Thessalonians 1:6-10

That Day is something for all of us to look forward to!

JLB

JLB, why did you nof address the language "apo arti" in Math..26:64?
Why did you not show me a scripture where Ciaphas saw Jesus' second coming in a vision or by the Spirit?
Were your arguments actually only hypothetical?

10 "when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints"
....."IN his saints...."
He is and will be glorified IN us, because Christ is IN us!
That Day has come my friend, Arise, and allow Him to be glorified in you!

When you post the scripture that pertains to Jesus Christ Coming at the end of the age to gather His Church.

JLB

JLB

I gave already given you 2 scriptures which refer to the Lord coming and his gathering of the saints, sorry if you do not accept them because they don't have the "specific language" you want to see.
1 thes 4:13-17 also.
Now address my points in Math.26:64
1. The language "apo arti" in Math..26:64?
2. Show me a scripture where Ciaphas saw Jesus' second coming in a vision or by the Spirit?


Thanks

 

[JLB]

1 thes 4:13-17 also.

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus. 15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

How do you see this scripture above as being different than Mark 13:26-27 -


26 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven.


JLB

 

[Hope of glory]

1 thes 4:13-17 also.

13 But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.
15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17
Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.

How do you see this scripture above as being different than Mark 13:26-27 -

26 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in the clouds with great power and glory. 27 And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven.


JLB

JLB
Answer
1. No resurrection is mentioned in Mark 13:26-27
2 The context in Mark 13 is only of Jerusalems destruction (verses 1-4)
3. The phrase "this generation" puts the fulfillment of Mark 13 within the first century (within 40 years of the prophecy)
(By the way, regarding the phrase "this generation", I have made the point several times that this phrase is spoken by Jesus in the gospels 15 times and alway without exception refers to Jesus' first century contemporary generation.....maybe you could address this FACT when you are willing to)

I have answered your question, now please address Math.26:64:
1. The language "apo arti" in Math..26:64?
2. Show me a scripture where Ciaphas saw Jesus' second coming in a vision or by the Spirit?

Thanks

 

[Deborah13]

Please show me from the scriptures, where Jesus ascended in the clouds and returned in the clouds.

I find this one.

9 Now when He had spoken these things, while they watched, He was taken up, and a cloud received Him out of their sight. 10 And while they looked steadfastly toward heaven as He went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel... Acts 1:9-10


JLB

JLB, I didn't say that He ascended into a cloud as at the transfiguration. I was responding to a response, that we can see in scripture where Jesus also ascended in John 20. So that is clearly two. We don't know how that happened in John 20 whether it be into a cloud or not, it doesn't say.

28 so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation. Hebrews 9:28

Jesus left this earth, as recorded by Acts 1:9-11, in a cloud, He will appear a second time, as recorded by Hebrews 9:28, for Salvation.

This is what the scriptures teach.

This is the truth.


JLB

I agree He will return again.

 

[JLB]

No resurrection is mentioned in Mark 13:26-27

Sorry, you couldn't be more wrong!!!

And then He will send His angels, and gather together His elect from the four winds, from the farthest part of earth to the farthest part of heaven.

As Paul uses this same term for resurrection -

1 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come.


the farthest part of heaven.= even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.


JLB

 

[Deborah13]

This is the truth.

JLB
I am sorry I have lost track of what you believe about some of this. Do you believe that ANY of Mark 13 is talking about 70 AD? If so, up to what point in the verses?

Thanks Deborah

 

[Brother Mike]

OK, going to have to take the 5th on this one. I am not convinced Luke's Account gives enough description about "this Generation shall not pass" Need to look at some other things.

So putting away the scripture cannon for a bit.

Mike.