Because he was to be killed on a cross.
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Guest, Join Papa Zoom today for some uplifting biblical encouragement! --> Daily Verses
What Does Jesus Say About A Saved Person Becoming Unsaved ?
- Thread starter Consecrated Life
- Start date
Brother , you need to count that in your blessings column . Because it will be like ripping your heart out to see it .
I would say these verses sum it up .
2 Peter 2
| 20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. |
| 21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. |
| 22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire. |
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Once had a new member at church and he was really on fire for God . He was there at every service and eager to worship God . We became friends , he had just started playing guitar and I played guitar too . We even played a few songs in the Church services . He was regular for about a year then all of a sudden with the end of his new marriage church was over for him . He never came back and I saw the odd FB post now and then but the signs were there that he returned to his partying days of old . I talked to him a few times after his falling away but he was done with church and God . He later died in a house fire laying on couch , passed out or drugged out would be a guess . Yeah , that hurts typing it out for you to read .
My uncle was an alcoholic for many years and was saved and joined the church , I saw the power of God moving on him in few church services . Maybe it lasted about a year then back down inside the bottle he went . He lost his wife and children through divorce , so now the bottle would get all of his attention . He died and early death from kidney failure . I loved him but he was a hard headed guy . Gone but not forgotten as they say .
Consecrated Life
Member
These are instances of a spiritual house being built with no lasting stability, no knowledge but firm decision for Christ.
Jesus made a point of this before Peter:
Luk 6:48
He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.
But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.
Not too important E.
He was born again at an early age.
Became the top biblical scholar on manuscripts in the world (I think).
He stopped b elieving about 15 years ago. He's in his 50's I'd say.
Some persons stop believing because of all the suffering they see.
We do have to admit this is the number one problem that Christianity faces.
My former GP used to believe. I asked him why he stopped.
He said he saw too "many things." Medical, no doubt.
Yes. It happens.
I think we can tell ourselves that they never believed to begin with because we find it comforting and
thinking a person could stop believing has more than one meaning that we, maybe, can't accept.
Sorry CL. I didn't understand what you were looking for.
First, I must say I admire you for this because when I have a question about some concept or other, I always refer back
to what Jesus said about it. So I'm with you on this.
You want to know what Jesus said about returning to a life of sin....
He stated that it's possible for a person to believe for a while....
Luke 8:13 The Parableof the Sower
13The seeds on the rocky soil represent those who hear the message and receive it with joy. But since they don’t have deep roots, they believe for a while, then they fall away when they face temptation.
He stated that a person could come to life again...
Luke 15:24 The Prodigal Son
24for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.’ And they began to celebrate.
Consecrated Life
Member
The rocky soil is the key to the parable Wondering .
The rocky soil can never be the foundation for a completed salvation.
Sure there is a belief there , there always is belief that precedes a conversion .
You couldn't have a conversion without this first having this intermediate rocky ,could be shaken, belief.
You can see this intermediate rocky belief with people Jesus encountered .
The woman at the well for instance .
There is a point where she believes wonderful miraculous things about Jesus, that He has the water that will make her never thirst again, she believes He can know everything about her, yet she is still has only a rocky belief.
This rocky soil belief is what Peter was standing on when Jesus told him that he had not yet arrived to salvation:
Luk 22:32
"But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren."
Bart doesn't believe in existence of the Father either though most of his work seems to be in sowing doubt to the things testified to as truth in the NT. Bart once claimed to be a born again Christain. He knows what that means. I asked Him via email, "How can one have the Spirit of Christ in them and not know Jesus lives?" He didn't reply.
Jesus stated He never knew them.
Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’
Whoever says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person.
Jude is unambiguous in declaring Gods faithfulness
To him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy— 25 to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen
To him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you before his glorious presence without fault and with great joy— 25 to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen
Hey All,
Why not jasonc? The prodigal son came back.
Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz
jasonc
Member
For if they have tasted the goodness of God and his righteous then have gone astray. There is no forgiveness for they have made the crucification afresh .
jasonc
Member
Hebrews 6:1 to 6
Consecrated Life
Member
The prodigal son was not converted when he demanded money for whores & filthy living.
His conversion came when he hit rock bottom with the pigs
Hebrews 6:4-6 For in the case of those once having been enlightened and having tasted of the heavenly gift and having become partakers of the Holy Spirit, and having tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and having fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame.
We are not talking about conversion. The prodigal son did not need conversion. That never comes up in the parable.
He was always the father's son. Pay attention to how the father greets the son, and how he treats the son. The son was never kicked out of the family. Read it again.
Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz
Consecrated Life
Member
secretmessenger
Member
I struggled with this for a bit as well, and I lean on the side of eternal security. Others have made the case and provided the scripture, I'd like to throw in a personal experience as well.
One night I lay wallowing a bit in self pity saying surely God has rejected me by now. A soothing voice spoke in my mind, something to the effect of 'I died for you, do you really think I would just let you go?'
I can only say if it were possible, it would be incredibly hard because of the overwhelming love of God towards us. He knows everything you ever have and ever will do, and He knows the right environment that leads us to repentance. I believe, especially for the redeemed that He steers us towards the place of repentance so that we can bear the fruit we were intended to by Him. Of course its our choice to allow it, and as long as you aren't bucking him at every step in willful rebellion I don't think you run into the danger of becoming apostate.
Hey All,
That's a great share secret messenger. Thank you.
Consecrated Life, the son was never disowned by the father.
The father knew that the son would return.
The father waited for him.
He watched for him.
He was overjoyed when he saw the son returning.
The father ran to meet the son.
He hugged the son.
He prepared a feast in celebration of the son's return.
Are those the reactions of a father that has disowned his son?
The son knew this also. When he was in with the pigs eating their slop, what moment of clarity did he have?
Luke 15:17-18 And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger!
I will arise and go to my father, and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee,
" . . . my father. . . "
The son still knew his father.
Father/son is an unbreakable bond when push comes to shove.
A son always knows his father regardless of what they might say to each other.
This is not the sin of no return.
The sin of no return is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit.
Which in this case would have been the son never returning.
That is why John tells us:
1 John 2:15 Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him.
1 John 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.
The son, deep down, still had love for the father.
The father always loves the son.
And that is the difference.
Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz
Consecrated Life
Member
Thanks for that.
A verse that I will carry with me always that I call upon ( And speak out LOUD) to myself at times of doubt is this:
Isa 43:1
"....... Fear not: for I have redeemed thee, I have called thee by thy name; thou art mine."
Consecrated Life
Member
Josef .
I never said the Father disowned the son ?
Please do not misquote me in that regard.
The son's lost estate has no bearing on the father's love for him .
Are we clear on that ?
Did you know that there will not be one person in hell who is there because God stopped loving them ?
God has never disowned a single person who ever lived.
God never stopped loving Adolf Hitler , and Hitler had no less opportunity to choose to be "found" by turning to God's Love, up until the moment he choose to seal his own eternal fate with a bullet.
2Pe 3:9
The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
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